Open letter to Thailand’s Software Bullies

June 21st, 2008 | by Sajal Kayan |

Kind attn : Microsoft Thailand (Sorry I cant read your Thai only website)
Kind attn : Lenovo Thailand (Sorry cant find name of contact on your site)
Kind attn : Prasert Charoonpaisal - General Manager - Personal Systems Group (PSG) - HP Thailand
Kind attn : Corporate Communications Dept. - Sony Thai Co., Ltd.
Kind attn : Asus Thailand (Sorry I cant read your Thai only website)
Kind attn : Acer Head Office - Acer Computer Co., Ltd.
Kind attn : Benq Thailand (Sorry I cant read your Thai only website)

Dear Sirs or Madams,

This is to bring to your notice that almost all notebooks available in Thailand come bundled with windows preloaded.

I had purchased a Sony VAIO 3 or 4 years ago which came bundled with Windows XP. Due to quality problems in the software provided, I had to switch over to a different Operating System. I have no claims on the licensing fee of the inferior software provided to me as during the time of purchase I had intended to use it, and I did for quite a while.

Now, the time has come for me to purchase a new notebook. A self conducted study at fortune town on June 20th 2008 reviled that almost all notebooks came with Windows pre-installed and the license bundled. On asking any of the vendors that I don’t want to pay for the license, I was informed it is impossible. The very limited selection of notebooks which do come without Windows pre-installed are bottom of the line models which are usually outdated or very heavy.

My questions to all of the addresses :-

  1. Do you assume a non-windows user to not be able to afford your mid-segment notebooks?
  2. Is your intention to force Linux users into buying a Windows license?
  3. Is this an effort to form a cartel against Linux?

Question to all the notebook vendors :-

  1. Do you refund any difference amount in case the buyer does not use the license?

Question to Lenovo :-

  1. Lenovo USA does offer an interesting range of notebooks without Windows. Does Lenovo Thailand do the same?

Question to Microsoft :-

  1. Do you refund any unused windows License?
  2. I am aware of the software piracy issues in Thailand, but have you ever conducted a study as to how many non-windows users own a windows license? Do you reduce this number when publishing piracy rates?

Please respond, via comment form below in English only. The replies would help me decide weather or not to get a new notebook here in Thailand or order it in the States or Singapore, potentially making the Thai Government suffer a loss of tax revenue.

PS : Apologies to other companies who fit my criteria and I missed them out! They are also free to respond.

Regards,
Sajal Kayan

Update 1 : Thanks to @bact for translating to Thai and publishing on blognone.

Update 2 : Online discussions at blognone and ubuntuclub.

  1. 13 Responses to “Open letter to Thailand’s Software Bullies”

  2. By Petchty on Jun 21, 2008 | Reply

    I want to answer or suggest my opinion from some questions:
    Q1: “Do you assume a non-windows user to not be able to afford your mid-segment notebooks?”
    A1: I think so, but notebooks in Thailand which don’t have Windows pre-installed have a good specification, such as Toshiba L310: 2.1GHz Core 2, X3100 integrated graphic card.
    Q2: “Is your intention to force Linux users into buying a Windows license?”
    A2: No, I think Microsoft doesn’t know which operating system(s) you use.
    Q3: “Is this an effort to form a cartel against Linux?”
    A3: No, you may have multi-operating systems in your PC. (I don’t know which ‘Linux’ distribution you want to install, but I know Microsoft against Redhat Linux.)
    Q4: “Do you refund any difference amount in case the buyer does not use the license?”
    A4: Please see the A6.
    P.S.: Sorry for wrong grammer.
    Q5: “Lenovo USA does offer an interesting range of notebooks without Windows. Does Lenovo Thailand do the same?”
    A5: I think Lenovo should provide mid- or high-segment notebooks don’t have Windows pre-installed. (But if I buy Lenovo notebook from Thailand which don’t have Windows pre-installed, I will buy Windows license.)
    Q6: “Do you refund any unused windows License?”
    A6: Please see EULA from Microsoft website. Open Microsoft website and type ‘EULA ‘ where is the software name you want to see EULA. But in general, I think Microsoft provide the way you refund. (From the sentence “By using the software, you accept these terms. If you do not accept them, do not use the software. Instead, contact the manufacturer or installer to determine their return policy for a refund or credit.”)
    Q7: “I am aware of the software piracy issues in Thailand, but have you ever conducted a study as to how many non-windows users own a windows license? Do you reduce this number when publishing piracy rates?”
    A7: I don’t know, please contact Microsoft!

    P.S.: I think you protest Microsoft about the licensing issues, but I think if ‘Bill Gate’ don’t talk about ‘licensing’ in the past, software development shouldn’t grow up to now.
    P.S.: Sorry for wrong grammer.

  3. By Sajal Kayan on Jun 21, 2008 | Reply

    Hi Petchty,

    Thanks for defending microsoft. I dont like microsoft, but in my letter above i dont intend to protest(yet ;) ) just need some answers!
    You spoke about Toshiba L310 i think this one : http://shop.site.in.th/en/product/21871/ it is 2.35 Kg. I spent over an hour yesterday looking. I couldnt find one below 2Kg which came without OS. 2.1 Ghz is not too high. last 2 days I spent time digging up on the net and it seems 2.6 Ghz core 2 duo is also available.

    Also ELUA might say that we have to check with manufacturer about refund of License, That’s the reason im asking the manufacturers here.

    PS : Lets debate about history some other day?

  4. By Patranun Limudomporn on Jun 21, 2008 | Reply

    Actually this is quite a problem for customers like us. Anyway, I’d prefered Windows pre-installed on my laptop or my PC already. However, if there’re customers like you, the computer manufacturers should concern about this issue. I guess it is not a Microsoft problem but it is depends on computer manufacturer. (Microsoft forced computer manufacturer to pre-loaded Windows? I guess not except there’re some interest or revenue.)

  5. By Moosamchun on Jun 22, 2008 | Reply

    Hello,
    About 80%. When they have bought a new PC/notebook,they asked the supplier…including the Windows or not ?

    Why ?

    Because I can not use the Linux,OpenOffice, My office uses the WindowsXP,My customers use MS-Office.

    Education and the policy of government will support.

    Thanks,
    ps. I have known you from blognone.com

  6. By Kobkrit on Jun 22, 2008 | Reply

    It’s very hard to find notebook without pre-loading Microsoft Windows.
    I find for a long time and I got one which is A8Sseries of ASUS.
    I use only linux so Why I pay for Windows?
    I will buy only notebook that gimme the linux or No-OS choice.
    So wise vendor should adapted themselves, If they want my money..

  7. By cloverink on Jun 23, 2008 | Reply

    So! In Thailand, notebook without OS windows is very hard to found it.

    same problems
    - i want to use xp pro. but that notebook spec to use xp home .. -3-

    so in Thai is a developing country, have so many people dont konw how to use OS window !!
    ( that mean linux os-x is impossible )

    please understand about agent.
    if you want to buy a spec require maybe you should be require spec to a major store.

  8. By Sajal Kayan on Jun 23, 2008 | Reply

    @Patranun : Thats exactly my point. I dont know if its microsoft who is forcing the vendors or if it is vendors who want to force customers. Customers must have a choice!

    @Moosamchun “Because I can not use the Linux,OpenOffice, My office uses the WindowsXP,My customers use MS-Office.” <– thats a very lame excuse. Thats what microsoft wants you to think. Linux is 100% compatible in a microsoft dominant ecology. Also openoffice opens all word files - Including Office 2007 format which i believe office xp does not!

    @Kobkrit Exactly my point. It is specifically “abusive monopoly”, where the big corporation wants to push their product(s) down your throat! This is unacceptable, we want answers!

  9. By Jom on Jun 25, 2008 | Reply

    I agree with you Mr.Sajal

    I hate M$ also and now i leave M$ behind and full-facing OS x now and mac software are compatible with M$ user quite-well

    BTW i never use linux or UBUNTU yet. But i think i will try later.

  10. By Petchty on Jun 27, 2008 | Reply

    Dear Sajal Kayan … I try to customize configure Lenovo notebook on Lenovo USA Website, but I found that I must select Windows version (XP / Vista) :)

  11. By Anonymous Coward on Jun 27, 2008 | Reply

    Hi, I don’t know if you realize this, but Thailand is one of the only (or perhaps the only) country in the world that brand name notebooks and desktops WITHOUT Windows can be sold openly. In other parts of the world, due to licensing issues with Microsoft, non-Windows notebooks have to be special ordered, which you can also do here in Thailand, especially if you want higher-end notebooks and not the cheap stuff they sell in the shops. (Be prepared to pay even more though, since you won’t be getting discounts.)

    If you can buy a notebook from abroad, you should consider that option, since you can get far better specs than anything you can get here, and you can even customize your notebook anyway you want, without having to pay ridiculous corporate prices.

  12. By Mark Rist on Jul 10, 2008 | Reply

    I’m afraid this is utter rubbish. I myself walked around fortune town a few days ago and was hard pushed to find laptops / notebooks that did come with Windows pre-installed. They seem to be charing similar prices but offering only fee Linix distributions or DOS which I think is a rip-off.

    If you claim not be have been able to find a machine without Windows then you must be blind.

  13. By Sajal Kayan on Jul 11, 2008 | Reply

    Mark : I guess you didnt read the letter in full.
    I said “almost all notebooks” . I did finally find only one lenovo notebook which match my specs and came with windows after 3 days of scouting the markets. The notebooks you are talking about are normally crappy celerons or weighing over 3 kg.

    Just let me know how many windows and non-windows notebooks you find which are : over 2 Ghz core 2 duo , 2 GB RAM and weighing less than 2 kg.

    Im afraid your comment is “utter rubbish” and you have replied without any research done. My point being that why does the notebook vendors have to shove windows up your a** ? please check carefully next time. The notebooks you were talking about were bottom of the line junk. Try getting the latest acer or HP models.

  14. By Sumet on Aug 12, 2008 | Reply

    This is just not the case for Linux users but for licensed Windows users too. My friend’s company own the multi-user license of Win XP.
    The problem is, many notebooks come with pre-installed Windows Vista we’ve never wanted to use. So, like Sajal’s question, why do we’ve to pay for what we don’t use? My friend/colleague bought the notebooks, low level formatted them and install the Windows XP. We wasted our money on Windows Vista!
    Hence, it would be great if they were Linux or Non-OS notebooks since we bought and of course, save some bucks from pre-installed Windows Vista.
    Regards,

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